SUNBEAMS
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From: Angelique L.
Date: Sunday, August 13, 2006, 11:44 AM
Subject: Sunbeams
Reply to: 256213
ID: 253829

Yes, Christina, I am so with you. I've run across men like Bruce, including my brother. He thinks that we women get big kicks out of "male bashing" and that if he joins in then I should be equally willing to accepting sexist jokes that subordinate women--I abhor both. Isn't it just incredible how easily we let men like Bruce enter what I too though of as "womenspace," but whenever women try to compete in a male dominated area, i.e. any and all American institutions, we have to fight our way in and are abused and poked fun at every step of the way, not only by men, but worse, by women who have contempt for we "femi-nazi" types--these women are truly dangerous for me to be around.

Thanks so much for venting your own anguish with this kind of thing. Which brings up a question I had immediately when I joined this site just yesterday: why are men allowed to post here? That's the whole problem with the P.C. side of feminism--we want so badly to demonstrate an environment of all inclusiveness that we wind up shooting ourselves in the foot. Why can't we simply say, "we do honor men, we all have fathers, husbands, brothers, sons, male friends, but we need a place that is off limits to men where we can feel free to express not just who we are individually, but who we WANT TO BE collectively." We can also add: "Thank you for honoring us so much that you want to take part, but you will do women and men a lot more good if you take what has attracted you here and share it with other men. Start a Gathering The Men global matrix and limit it to men who are truly committed to the same principles and vision for the future as Gathering The Women."

Years ago when there was only such a thing as listservs I was a regular poster to a feminist site and started getting "cyber stalked" by some disgruntled guy who had lost a custody battle for his kids. The threats became so outrageous that I finally called the FBI and they did trace the origin of the posts. But never found the guy. This was from a guy that started out seeming very open and tolerant of the women's discussion of what we considered "women's issues." This is not to say that a man couldn't still post using a woman's name. I think there should be guidelines about appropriateness for posting whether it's from men or women (not all women are on the same page about dismantling the patriarchy, believe me), and for that a forum administrator would be required

Just my $.02 for what it's worth.

Namaste. Angelique